Transforming Clinic on the Inner Game of Basketball with Felix Engel

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Welcome to the Transforming Basketball Podcast. On today's episode, we have Felix Angel. Felix is a professional coach who works for Münster. He also works for their youth department as well as coaching the under-18 team. He is also doing coach education for the German Federation.

And of course, Felix has been on the podcast before and is a Transforming Clinician himself. So Felix, welcome back to the show.

Thanks for having me, George.

So firstly, today we're going to cover the inner game of basketball. But before we get into this, I do want to ask you just about your experience so far this year and just maybe a recap of, you know, all the things that you're doing that you'd like to share.

I mean, this inner game of basketball is a constant thing that I think about, you know, it's always with me. And I think when we talk about coaches' education, we talk so much about coverage solutions. We talk about motor learning. We talk about differential learning.

We talk about shooting, finishing. But as a coach mentor, I do feel like that this theme of what are your beliefs and how those beliefs impacting the things you do in the gym, that there needs to be a little bit more intention to it.

And this is especially when I coach, when I talk with younger coaches. It always gets to this point at some point, you know? So, yeah.

Yeah. And just because I do want to just unpack a little bit, let's go into, I have a mindset or an identity. I am a shooter. So, you know, coaches tell me that, my teammates tell me that, my parents, and I believe in myself.

How can this act as a limiting constraint that maybe prevents players from exploring the full landscape of the game, all the affordances that may be available?

First of all, I think everybody is influenced by the experience that they have, but the problem often is that they interpret events in a way so their mind can understand and unpack them in a way, you know? So this is normal. So if I think it can be a limiting factor, but maybe we could scale it in another way.

For example, I was not good in math. Okay? So if I came home to my parents and I had a 5 or an F, I think it's in the States, I would say, I'm bad at math. And my teacher would say, I'm bad at math.

And my parents or my father used to say to me, yeah, I was bad at math too. It's just the things they are. You are bad at math too. Instead of saying, I've written an F or a 5 in math. You know, can you hear the difference?

Because this is like making a path in my brain that I'm believing now I'm not good in math, and it sinks into my mind and eventually maybe becomes my reality or my truth without even questioning that, you know. And this can be highly limiting players too.

When you talk to guys, you know, when you give feedback like, you're not a good shooter, instead of saying Yeah, you just, you missed 8 out of the last 10 shots. This is a huge difference, like language-wise, but also like in terms of creating an identity, you know.

What advice would you give then for coaches that are trying to shift this identity? So maybe a kid, let's keep the same example. He is, oh, you are a shooter. So what advice would you give to coaches to talk to this kid so he's not only just a shooter, but he's a whole basketball player and doesn't have this Limiting belief that he's just a shooter.

I would really make a statement of what I've been observing, you know, because this is already an interpretation of what I'm seeing, you know. Maybe the next day he's not hitting well, you know, but then I'd really say what I see, you know.

So instead of saying, yeah, yeah, George, you're just amazingly talented and a good shooter, I'd say, George, man, I've been seeing the effort, the work you've put in for the last 3, 4 weeks. You've come early to practice, like shooting your shots, doing differential learning.

And the last exercise, you made 8 out of 10. This is a high percentage shooting right there. I'd make statements from what I observe instead of what I've been interpreting. And there's so much evidence also about effort feedback and intelligence feedback. So this would be a practical example for me, how I talk to my players.

Right. So you would go more towards the route of, you know, you have been doing everything that an elite shooter does. You've been putting the effort, the time, the work, but then you would just focus on giving him the observation of, you know, what he's been doing versus telling him, giving him this, planting the seed of the identity.

But also Felix, let's maybe reverse it and flip it. And like, what if you want to give a player an identity? Is that a good thing? Should you do that?

I think they will create an identity by themselves anyway, you know. And I don't know if it's— I think this is something that we also have to be very careful about what we say in terms of people. I think they identify themselves too often with their beliefs, their projects, and also their results, you know.

And it can be a driving thing, a motivator, because if I have like this I'm not good enough belief, it drives me. It gives me motivation on the one hand, but also on the other hand, it can drive me into burnout. And can, like, when is it enough?

And I think the same with you as a coach. If you listen to this, instead of saying I'm a bad coach when you lose a game, just rephrase it and say, we lost the game, we have to work on XYZ. And really be more observing what was not functional, what was not working, instead of generalizing and interpreting the things.

Because it's also vice versa. If you win all the time and you say you're a great coach, you're identifying yourself with that. And with this kind of new perspective on that, you cannot do it either way. And maybe this is the middle ground that you should be finding yourself.

And I remember I read 11 Rings by Phil Jackson and he, you know, said throughout the book, you can't control the outcome. You can only control the process. And I think it's like focusing more on, you know, how did we win and what did we do good to win versus like, I'm a great coach because we won.

And same thing, you know, you're a great shooter because you're, you're making shots, but are you putting in the work and the process to be a great shooter?

And I would really like— and this is— I can't stress this enough. Okay, so when I started my coaching journey, I wanted to have something. And then I read The 11 Rings. I read, like, I read so many books about successful coaches because I wanted to do good things in practice, because I wanted to be a great coach.

So if you have listened to this, it was I wanted to have something.

Yeah.

In order to do something, and then in order to be something. This was my way of coaching journey in the beginning. And then somebody came into my practice where I had a mentor. And after the practice, he asked me a simple question which changed everything for me.

He asked me, Felix, what kind of coach do you want to be? And it changed the whole perspective and transformed the way I looked at myself because I now had to think about what values are important to me. And once I knew that, I knew what to do.

And then everything that came afterwards was just like all the results, all the outcomes were just a byproduct, like a checkpoint on becoming the coach I wanted to be. You know what I mean? So this was really mind-blowing to me. And I would invite every young coach who's listening right now to ask yourself this kind of question and maybe be intentional about what kind of question you ask yourself.

And I guess then the question is, what kind of values do I want to have in my practice environment? What do I want to teach these players that are valuable for my life that could also be valuable for them?

Exactly. And then I really got into depth with things that were interesting for me. This is when I started getting into the CLA Because I wanted to do it more playful and more joyful. But I also started questioning myself, okay, how to deal with certain behaviors?

What do I do when a player makes a turnover, which is no problem for me, but what if he stops playing after that and just standing still? Because one of my values is for sure effort. And how do I deal with that then?

And this was a Very curious path of figuring out what works for me and whatnot, you know?

Yeah, no, absolutely. So I have the question here I had was like, how do you shift the player's identity from passive to aggressive? But I guess using the example you just used is how can we design small-sided games that force a new identity to emerge?

So for example, if you want a player to have effort, how are you going to design small-sided games and give them feedback? To make sure that after he turns the ball over, he's still sprinting back on defense or whatever it is.

Yeah. And I think this also sometimes gets lost when I see and I observe like so many small-sided games that are used right now, which are really good. And then sometimes the coach doesn't recognize when it's too fatiguing, you know, and when it's not intense anymore, because we all want to Have that optimum challenge point in a player.

And I do believe that intensity and effort is where people get out of their comfort zone into the learning zone. And I think we developed, or I developed, like, I don't know if you can say that like this, but overarching game principles. Can you say it like this?

One principle was for us, we keep on playing. So in our practices, and this is what I observed also with other coaches, they would play a finishing game, one-on-one game, and after one shot, they would grab the ball, get into the queue, back into the line.

And then I would have a conversation with the coach afterwards. And the first thing he said to me, Felix, we got a rebounding problem, man. I don't know what to do. How can we fix that? What kind of activities and drills do you know?

And I said, I tried to reflect with him together. on how this finishing and not finishing the play, not keep on playing, has a significant impact on the way that they are not creating the habit of rebounding and boxing out. So for me, this is the number one rule which I would discuss with my team in preseason camp and then also ask the players, okay, what do we do if somebody's making a mistake, especially like a turnover, which is totally fine?

Everybody's going to do that. But what happens if you do not run back? What would you do, guys? You know, so in terms of autonomy, you know, take them, make them talk. What could be a solution? You know, and I think this is important.

I think it's so important too, because I think learning how to speak and how to answer questions, like almost like media training, but like in a practice scenario, is so important because a lot of the times players are shy, especially the younger ones.

And they don't want to answer. So when we ask these questions and we keep poking them a little like, oh, but why? And getting them to come out, it's so important because they learn by us asking the questions and pulling them out as well versus just giving them the answers.

Because I love how you said you had the discussion versus saying, all right, this is what you need to do.

Yeah, this is a big— like, I'm a big believer in this, you know, and When I think it's also like a balance when to ask a question in practice and when not, because I want practice to be intense, you know. And I think coming back to this aggressive and intense practice environment, I've heard this terminology of psychological safety, to create a room of psychological safety, you know.

And I think there's a big misconception about psychological safety. Versus harmony. Because I see a lot of coaches now, actually what they want to have is harmony. They want no truthful words spoken. Their critique is packed into nice cotton balls. They are not transparent.

And then I do believe when you're not transparent in what you're going to do, what's going to be a consequence, and when you're not demanding things that you said that you're going to do, Like, there's going to be insecurity in the players. And where there's insecurity in an environment, there's no trust.

And then is most of the times, or at least what I can say from my experience, mediocre performance. And psychological safety for me means, like, stop trying to please everyone, have clear boundaries. Everybody is allowed to say especially the unpleasant things. And I know who I stand with you.

You know, this is important, and I'm transparent. I'm consistent in the agreed terms and conditions, and I'm also demanding them. You know, however they may look like in your environment. But I think this is this is really important because if the player like you had a you had a discussion or like in preseason you talked about certain things how you handle this turnover situation, and then.

You say, okay, we agreed on this. And then this instant happens in the practice and now situation is over. And if you not truly believe in what you've discussed with your team, you will not intervene. And then I guarantee you, at least this is what happens with me, people be like, man, Felix talked about this in the locker room and now he's not saying the things he's going to do.

He's not doing the things that he was saying he will do, and now you don't, or you lose integrity, I think, you know.

And the players don't know, I guess, if they can trust you as a coach, because if we just rewind this back to the beginning, you've set your values, your team principles, and now you're letting players get away with, you know, they're not continuing playing and they're not doing the principles of play consistently.

And now if you're not standing up for these beliefs, you're, to your point, the integrity is not there and And the players can't trust you as a coach. And then it's, you know, the psychological safety, I think, goes both ways. If the players know exactly what they can do and they can't do, then they'll, all right, I can try this and fail and it's good.

Coach wants that versus, you know, I can try this and I don't know what's going to happen. I don't know what the coach wants. 100%.

And this, like, I know what it's like being a young coach, you know, to really do this. It takes courage, it takes self-confidence to really like— and let's be honest, or at least in my context, it's always the most talented guys at the age group who are making a mistake.

I also say this to my players, you know, I do believe they are not sprinting back because they want to hurt the team. They are frustrated with themselves, you know, and also to acknowledge that and to say that, you know, George, I do see you.

I see that you're probably frustrated and disappointed with yourself. But I think to create an empathy, and this is what sports does in such an impactful way. George, what do you think? How are the other 4 guys feeling if you're not running back?

How does it make them feel? And I don't want to do this against you, but— We've agreed that in every practice and every game, we're going to sprint back.

And how do you— we're talking a lot about the internal, you know, and asking questions and making them consider. Of course, like basketball is played externally and you, when you give feedback, you want to give external cues. So how do you kind of balance between, all right, let's think about this and versus when it's in the middle of the game and you need to address an issue and you, you know, it needs to be something that they can act on.

Right away. How do you do that?

I think, yeah, this is what experience and just trying to figure out what your values are and what's important for you, and then just go with it. You know, for me, there are always non-negotiables in my team. You know, for example, when I do hear a racist comment, you know, this is a non-negotiable for me where there's going to be no discussion, no whatever.

Like, we're going to have a talk with you and your parents and maybe with president of our club. And if there's physical violence, you know, I will not tolerate this. And there are other things. For example, if somebody stops playing, this is for, at least for me, my value is very important.

And I would make— I wouldn't explain that in the gym because the gym and the practice time and the time on task is so important to me that I would do this in preseason camp, you know, and really develop it with the team together.

And also, like, yeah, what could be a consequence if somebody doesn't change his behavior? You know, because we all agreed upon this, you know.

And so let's, let's keep it here and just real specific here. If you were in that situation in the game right now and you had to give a quick feedback, let's just do all 3. Let's say it's in the middle of the game and they're not doing what they're doing.

It's a free throw stop or it's a timeout. So those 3 scenarios, those same things where a player's not running back. How are you addressing each one of those?

I'm not saying that my way is the correct or right way, but for me, in preseason, it would be like in the soccer— like in the soccer games, there would be a yellow card and there would be a red card, you know. And when there's a red card, he's out of the practice.

And when he's not sprinting back in the game, he'd be subbed out without discussion. I don't say that this is right, you know. This is just the way I handle it. Explaining to the players, I'm not doing this against you, I'm doing this for the team.

And also every time giving him or her the perspective of what's your behavior causing the other teammates? Because most of the time people don't think about that in their moment. They're so into their own frustration or disappointment that they don't even think about that.

You know, I did it with my team in practice, and it was tough for me also the first time because it was one of my best players. But after that, it didn't happen anymore. You know, it didn't happen anymore because everybody knew then, okay, shit, he's really going to do that.

He doesn't care if it's the best player. He's really going to do that.

And I think that's where it's hard, isn't it? When it is your best player. So it's like, now everyone knows, like, you've done it. You've set the standard. Everyone knows what the standard is. And that if they get below it, there's a consequence for it.

I think to your point, regardless if you're right or wrong, every coach does things differently. And it's not about being right or wrong, but it's about staying true to your standard and the values that you set. And I think as long as the players can respect that, then it's fine.

You know, there's different types of coaching all over the place. And I don't think any one of them is wrong, but it is just about making sure the standards are followed. The values are being upheld. So that the players have this psychologically safe space to play in, fail, get better.

100%. And then don't do any punishes anymore, you know, because I can still remember to this day that I had a coach, somebody was not running back, and he said, everybody on the fucking baseline, we're going to do suicides, you know. And I was thinking to myself, I didn't do anything wrong.

Like, I sprint back all the fucking time, you know, like, why am I punished For his kind of behavior. This was also in the reflection of who I want to be as a coach. I wanted to be a fair, transparent, but also consistently demanding my standards and values that I developed with the team.

This is like the only consequence I do my practice, like losing for— or if you don't win a 1-on-1, or if you don't win a small-sided game, For me, this is punishing enough because everybody is so motivated. And I do feel like, especially when we talk about the athletic department, when you do push-ups, when you do suicide, I haven't seen a change in the behavior that has occurred, which I'm not good with, by punishing them with the athletic things.

And when you think about it even a step further, I don't say that this must happen, but it could be that the player have a bad belief about doing push-ups and doing sprint practice, which should be additionally to your basketball performance. It can enhance your performance, your affordances.

You see different things when you get faster, when you jump higher. And all of a sudden, this is kind of a punishment. For me, it shouldn't be like this. It should be separated.

Maybe you've seen it come across on Instagram. Joe Mazzulla talking about the winners get to run and the losers have to walk.

I heard him say about that.

Yeah. Yeah, I think it's awesome. So Felix, I want to ask you, obviously you work a lot with the German Federation. You help coaches out. If you walk into an environment and you see that, you know, there's not a good culture there. And what I mean by that is it's maybe, you know, they're doing things that you don't advise.

I don't know, you know, maybe they're talking over the coach or, you know, there's not enough time on task, water breaks are too long, whatever. There is like a losing identity for that team. What's the first thing that you would change to begin to shift towards a winning culture?

I wouldn't change anything because I can't. I would invite the coach to reflect with me only if he wants to do that. Because if he doesn't want to reflect and if he doesn't want to get feedback, I wouldn't give him any feedback if I would be just another coach.

If I would be the sports director, then I have a different hat on, a different role. It would be a different thing. But if I'd be the mentor of a coach like that, again, I wouldn't be saying the time on task was too low.

The first thing I would do is sit in his practice. have a stop clock and stop, like, pick one player and stop his time on task. On the other hand, I would have another stop clock and I would, every time the coach is talking, I would let it go and then stop once he's finished.

And just showing him, just showing him the facts, you know, this was the time on task for your players. This was your time talking. What can you see? Oh, shit. I would never thought I'd be talking so much, Felix. This is so helpful right now.

I don't know why this happens. And then I would encourage him and invite him, okay, next week the goal is you explain every activity in 30 seconds and let them go. And even if somebody has a question, just flip the ball in because they'll figure it out themselves.

And then the time on task is back again, to give a practical example. If you're listening to this right now and you don't have a coach mentor, like ask a good friend, ask maybe your assistant coach to do this for you. You know, this is, I think, a good starting point to increase time on task and reduce your explanation time.

You can even like leave your iPhone or your phone on a voice recorder and just see, you know, how much time you actually spent talking versus the time practice. You know, if you don't have an assistant coach, maybe. Felix, I want to thank you for your time.

The last time you were here, we didn't have the transformative tip question. So I do want to ask you that. But before I do, I just want to say thank you for your time and thank you for your growth mindset. I think every time I've been around you and spoke with you, you've always had this desire to keep learning and keep growing.

So I really appreciate that about you. So transformative tip, we ask all our guests this. What's one piece of advice that you would give to a coach to instantly improve his practice environment? I know we just touched on it a little bit.

Stop trying to have success in order to do something and then becoming someone. Just think about who you want to be as a coach, then figuring out how to make those values come into life in your practice. And then everything that comes afterwards, It's just a byproduct of becoming the coach that you want to be.

That would be my, my most important advice, especially for the younger coaches who are listening right now.

Wow, that's a new one. We haven't had that one before. So it's think about who you want to be as a coach, and then everything else will follow that.

I do believe that. I do believe that.

Love it. It's great. Felix, thank you so much.

George, thanks for having me.

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